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Don’t educate your daughter if you want to make her an ideal bahu!
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India :
When I analyze the failed marriage of my cousin Deepa, I wonder if its her liberal brought up and education, or the conservative attitude of the Indian in-laws that is the actual culprit in breaking her marriage? We might want to take sides and point our fingers at one of the parties, but I think that the actual problem is with neither, but with the pace of development of different socio-cultural aspects our country. We have raised the status of women from the dumb, homely and uneducated to the highly-learned and sophisticated in leaps and bounds, but there in no significant progress in the in-law mentality. An Indian girl has become modern but the in-law mentality has hardly changed. The majority of them are conservative. Had there been comparable metamorphosis in both aspects, failed marriages would be rarely seen.
We have educated the girl, but we have failed to educate the in-laws. You send a girl to the best schools and colleges and give her international exposure. After that the in-laws expect her to be a mute lamb. I’m really surprised by some Indian men and their families who don’t think a woman deserves any marital rights! If you educate a girl she will naturally compare herself with her global counterparts and she will definitely want to be at par with them. She will also come to know about her rights and when you get her married she will definitely start assessing what she has got and what she hasn’t got. Anyways of what use will be big degrees to her, if she won’t be allowed to use them? You’ll be a very cruel parent if you give your daughter a very modern upbringing and then push her into a conservative Indian family. How will your daughter be happy when she belongs to the 21st century and the in-laws belong to the 19th century? Shouldn’t the in-law mentality be of the 21st century to accommodate the views of your daughter, or it should be vice versa.
Since the majority of in-laws want to enjoy their privileges they would want to cling on to their 19th century mindsets. In that case, if you want to see your daughter happy, marry her off as a child. Don’t let her grow because if she’ll see her in-laws penalizing her pappa for dowry, she’ll be pained. A child will be unaware of the hardships her parents have to face in getting her married. At least she’ll be at peace. Also she’ll not bother her in-laws for her rights as she’ll not be aware of them. The in-laws can bring a mute baby lamb and mold her the way they want to. The marriage will be peaceful.
Now, its upon us Indians to decide upon how we’d like to keep our daughters happy – by reforming ourselves to match the pace of development of our daughters, or to throttle the development of our daughters to meet our selfish requirements. Which way would you choose?
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Leena
Nice article. I expect more such articles from you, however, a little bit of extra sharpening is recommended.
Nice article. I expect more such articles from you, however, a little bit of extra sharpening is recommended.
(Local Perspectives)
Aneez,
Do you mean ”extra sharpening” as ”fine tuning”...
There are good in laws and parents around in our society. The newspapers do not publicise these as much as the problems are reported. We read so much about controlling inlaws spying the daughter in law, husband sidng his mother or sister in law always, interference in each of the activities by them etc.
As Maya rightly pointed, the bride is not only marrying the groom but also getting (wed)locked with the whole family remainder of her life.
Do you mean ”extra sharpening” as ”fine tuning”...
There are good in laws and parents around in our society. The newspapers do not publicise these as much as the problems are reported. We read so much about controlling inlaws spying the daughter in law, husband sidng his mother or sister in law always, interference in each of the activities by them etc.
As Maya rightly pointed, the bride is not only marrying the groom but also getting (wed)locked with the whole family remainder of her life.
(Local Perspectives)
Mr. Rajagopalan
I meant ’extra sharpening’ of the tip of her pencil, to sketch a better and refined sarcastic portrait of what is happening in too many Indian families.
I meant ’extra sharpening’ of the tip of her pencil, to sketch a better and refined sarcastic portrait of what is happening in too many Indian families.
(Local Perspectives)
I guess you are saying that females deserve to have misery all of their days.
It is ok for the in-laws to treat the girl like a slave because they have always treated them like slaves, they are only there to cook, clean, and make babies after all, they are not there to talk. Who cares if she is happy? They are just unwanted burdens that you have to feed and clothe, forget taking her to the doctor...she already costs too much....and that pitiful amount of dowery...we should have gotten more for taking on her father’s miserable cast off.... she hasn’t even produced one son yet!... now we have to feed her pathetic offspring too... How much are we in-laws supposed to put up with?
And guess what, a lifetime of being the unwanted outsider makes her all too willing to dish out the same punishment on her own daughter-in-law one day.
All that suffering in silence has built up a huge bubble of bad Karma that hangs in the air like a black cloud, suffocating the joy of life out of all in its shadow.
I have taught women in a battered women’s shelter how to read for years... take it from me... being uneducated does not make any one happy.
It is ok for the in-laws to treat the girl like a slave because they have always treated them like slaves, they are only there to cook, clean, and make babies after all, they are not there to talk. Who cares if she is happy? They are just unwanted burdens that you have to feed and clothe, forget taking her to the doctor...she already costs too much....and that pitiful amount of dowery...we should have gotten more for taking on her father’s miserable cast off.... she hasn’t even produced one son yet!... now we have to feed her pathetic offspring too... How much are we in-laws supposed to put up with?
And guess what, a lifetime of being the unwanted outsider makes her all too willing to dish out the same punishment on her own daughter-in-law one day.
All that suffering in silence has built up a huge bubble of bad Karma that hangs in the air like a black cloud, suffocating the joy of life out of all in its shadow.
I have taught women in a battered women’s shelter how to read for years... take it from me... being uneducated does not make any one happy.
(Global Perspectives)
Hi Everybody,
Thanks for your viewpoints once again. I think only Mr. Aneez Sheikh understood the hidden sarcasm that the title conveys, and I’m thankful to him for that. Fine tuning is something that good writers like him can help me out with to convey the real meaning of this article.
As Maya says, education has never prevented anyone from meeting the expectations of in-laws. Education is meant to enlighten people by removing their egos, self-centeredness, rigidity and make them accept other people with respect and warmth. This is what many of our educated and virtuous girls are doing. Don’t you see a Ph D. bahu, removing the shoes of her husband when he comes back form office? I have and I feel that’s what an ideal bahu should be like. But she will be able to do so only if her sincerity and warmth are reciprocated. But how many in-laws reciprocate? When the DIL serves them with affection, they think she’s bound to serve them as a mark of gratitude for the social status of a bhau that they have given her, and its their birth right to enjoy her services.
You are correct Mr. Rajagopalan when you say that there are many good in-laws. My statement, “Had there been comparable growth in both aspects, failed marriages would be rarely seen.” conveys exactly that. Don’t you think those in-laws who are warm, understanding and reciprocating to their bahus have actually broken themselves from the fetters of superiority complex, self-centeredness and greed, by EDUCATING themselves to be so.? They have liberated themselves from the conservative in-law mentality which unfortunately remains the mentality of the mass Indian population.
Finally, you treat your daughter as a princess, don’t you ? But when she goes to her in-laws she is treated like what Nuya has described. “ they have always treated them like slaves, they are only there to cook, clean, and make babies after all, they are not there to talk. Who cares if she is happy? They are just unwanted burdens that you have to feed and clothe, forget taking her to the doctor...she already costs too much....and that pitiful amount of dowery...we should have gotten more for taking on her father’s miserable cast off.... she hasn’t even produced one son yet!... now we have to feed her pathetic offspring too..” Don’t treat her like a loved and cared for person because in her in-laws place, the harsh reality will shock and traumatize her.
If you think the conservative in-law mentality is correct, give her the treatment that in-laws would in your own house. She’ll be atleast prepared for her marital home.
Thanks for your viewpoints once again. I think only Mr. Aneez Sheikh understood the hidden sarcasm that the title conveys, and I’m thankful to him for that. Fine tuning is something that good writers like him can help me out with to convey the real meaning of this article.
As Maya says, education has never prevented anyone from meeting the expectations of in-laws. Education is meant to enlighten people by removing their egos, self-centeredness, rigidity and make them accept other people with respect and warmth. This is what many of our educated and virtuous girls are doing. Don’t you see a Ph D. bahu, removing the shoes of her husband when he comes back form office? I have and I feel that’s what an ideal bahu should be like. But she will be able to do so only if her sincerity and warmth are reciprocated. But how many in-laws reciprocate? When the DIL serves them with affection, they think she’s bound to serve them as a mark of gratitude for the social status of a bhau that they have given her, and its their birth right to enjoy her services.
You are correct Mr. Rajagopalan when you say that there are many good in-laws. My statement, “Had there been comparable growth in both aspects, failed marriages would be rarely seen.” conveys exactly that. Don’t you think those in-laws who are warm, understanding and reciprocating to their bahus have actually broken themselves from the fetters of superiority complex, self-centeredness and greed, by EDUCATING themselves to be so.? They have liberated themselves from the conservative in-law mentality which unfortunately remains the mentality of the mass Indian population.
Finally, you treat your daughter as a princess, don’t you ? But when she goes to her in-laws she is treated like what Nuya has described. “ they have always treated them like slaves, they are only there to cook, clean, and make babies after all, they are not there to talk. Who cares if she is happy? They are just unwanted burdens that you have to feed and clothe, forget taking her to the doctor...she already costs too much....and that pitiful amount of dowery...we should have gotten more for taking on her father’s miserable cast off.... she hasn’t even produced one son yet!... now we have to feed her pathetic offspring too..” Don’t treat her like a loved and cared for person because in her in-laws place, the harsh reality will shock and traumatize her.
If you think the conservative in-law mentality is correct, give her the treatment that in-laws would in your own house. She’ll be atleast prepared for her marital home.
(Local Perspectives)
Sorry! in the first paragraph of my comment I meant extra-sharpening in place of fine tuning.
(Local Perspectives)
Sorry! in the first paragraph of my comment I meant extra-sharpening in place of fine tuning
(Local Perspectives)
Sorry! in the first paragraph of my comment I meant extra-sharpening in place of fine tuning.
(Local Perspectives)
One should take note of the Maya’s ability to call a spade a spade in an environment wherein to promote corrupt behaviour in the women ,all in the name of acceptance of progressive ideals,has become favourite pastime of present age intellectuals.
Maya is not against the education of women.She is against the misuse of education which in absence of values has become source of trouble instead of creating harmony.It’s breaking the homes.
May I know what’s the reason behind the rise of nuclear families ?
Let’s not forget that the girls of today are tomorrow’s mother-in-laws.They may also be shown the door by their daughter-in-laws because of the ”adjustment problem” caused by irrational behaviour of theirs.
Maya is not against the education of women.She is against the misuse of education which in absence of values has become source of trouble instead of creating harmony.It’s breaking the homes.
May I know what’s the reason behind the rise of nuclear families ?
Let’s not forget that the girls of today are tomorrow’s mother-in-laws.They may also be shown the door by their daughter-in-laws because of the ”adjustment problem” caused by irrational behaviour of theirs.
(Local Perspectives)
If the harmony of the home can only be achieved by making one member of the home utterly miserable, then that home needs to be broken wide open.
Why should it be the bride that does all of the suffering? Why does using and abusing her make the rest of the family so happy? In all these months on instablogs, I have only seen talk of what SHE should be doing or what SHE should not be doing. It is like the word SHE is a vulgar word for some alien creature.
Using a person for a maid is not a value, it is a disgrace. Wanting to be treated like a human being is not an irrational behavior.
I have to wonder what the education system in India is like, is it just a means for chasing a buck or is it well rounded so that the people come out of it with varied interests and are capable of being engaging and companionable?
Just who in the hell do you play with and laugh with and talk to and cry with??? Who brings you soup when you are sick? Who do you baby and fawn over when they are sick? What is all this crap about maintenance, dowry and ATM machines?
I don’t understand any of this... I will walk across hot coals barefooted to get to someone who needs help but I am not doing a damn thing for
anyone who orders me or expects me to obey them. Even my bosses (except for 1)asked me to do things, they didn’t order and if that is what is happening to those girls you can’t blame them for putting their foot down.
Why should it be the bride that does all of the suffering? Why does using and abusing her make the rest of the family so happy? In all these months on instablogs, I have only seen talk of what SHE should be doing or what SHE should not be doing. It is like the word SHE is a vulgar word for some alien creature.
Using a person for a maid is not a value, it is a disgrace. Wanting to be treated like a human being is not an irrational behavior.
I have to wonder what the education system in India is like, is it just a means for chasing a buck or is it well rounded so that the people come out of it with varied interests and are capable of being engaging and companionable?
Just who in the hell do you play with and laugh with and talk to and cry with??? Who brings you soup when you are sick? Who do you baby and fawn over when they are sick? What is all this crap about maintenance, dowry and ATM machines?
I don’t understand any of this... I will walk across hot coals barefooted to get to someone who needs help but I am not doing a damn thing for
anyone who orders me or expects me to obey them. Even my bosses (except for 1)asked me to do things, they didn’t order and if that is what is happening to those girls you can’t blame them for putting their foot down.
(Global Perspectives)
Nuya,
Thanks for the powerful delivery! I was trying to convey just this.
Though the in-law mentality is improving in recent times, largely it remains conservative. What’s surprising is that this is noticed in the NRI culture also. I was shocked at knowing that dowry system is practiced amongst Indian Americans! A cousin of mine, a Chicago-based medical practitioner had to shell out huge amounts of money to get a groom of her community!
I believe that we are all human beings first and no human being has the right to dominate another merely for keeping up with the conservative value systems!
As Mr. Rajagopalan pointed out, there are good in-laws too in India, but they are relatively few, and they are the ones who have realized the importance and advantages of a liberal outlook.
Thanks for the powerful delivery! I was trying to convey just this.
Though the in-law mentality is improving in recent times, largely it remains conservative. What’s surprising is that this is noticed in the NRI culture also. I was shocked at knowing that dowry system is practiced amongst Indian Americans! A cousin of mine, a Chicago-based medical practitioner had to shell out huge amounts of money to get a groom of her community!
I believe that we are all human beings first and no human being has the right to dominate another merely for keeping up with the conservative value systems!
As Mr. Rajagopalan pointed out, there are good in-laws too in India, but they are relatively few, and they are the ones who have realized the importance and advantages of a liberal outlook.
(Local Perspectives)
@Nuya
You are little aware of the fact that brides are given due respect in Indian homes.Mother-in-law in an Indian home enjoy commanding position.How come she is not able to feel the pains of newly arrived wife?And why the same newly married wife when turns into mother-in-law uses the same dirty tricks to harass her daughter in law?Why she does not set better precedents ?
Anyway, I read somewhere that your mother too struggled to make you people very happy? Why do you see it as something glorious when the very same attitude depicted by Indian lady appears to be indicative of her slavery ?
Your most of the comments smack of double standards and are also indicative of your ignorance.You are simply not aware of the fact that we belong to a very different world and have our cultural beliefs.First be aware of the fact females are not exploited but given due respect.
However,that’s not an attempt to hide the problems associated with them.There are dark corners in form of wrong practices but every effort is being made to set the things right.
Anyway,reality is different from what you have come to know about India from statistics and so-called progressive literature.
So get real!Yes,Indian women is facing lot of problems.But that does not give someone the license to draw biased, fallacious and flawed observations about Indian society.
You are little aware of the fact that brides are given due respect in Indian homes.Mother-in-law in an Indian home enjoy commanding position.How come she is not able to feel the pains of newly arrived wife?And why the same newly married wife when turns into mother-in-law uses the same dirty tricks to harass her daughter in law?Why she does not set better precedents ?
Anyway, I read somewhere that your mother too struggled to make you people very happy? Why do you see it as something glorious when the very same attitude depicted by Indian lady appears to be indicative of her slavery ?
Your most of the comments smack of double standards and are also indicative of your ignorance.You are simply not aware of the fact that we belong to a very different world and have our cultural beliefs.First be aware of the fact females are not exploited but given due respect.
However,that’s not an attempt to hide the problems associated with them.There are dark corners in form of wrong practices but every effort is being made to set the things right.
Anyway,reality is different from what you have come to know about India from statistics and so-called progressive literature.
So get real!Yes,Indian women is facing lot of problems.But that does not give someone the license to draw biased, fallacious and flawed observations about Indian society.
(Local Perspectives)
Wow! I can’t even imagine that happening here. The few Indian women I have known from the university or from work. They are all smart, witty, talented and gorgeous. There is no way they would have to pay a man to marry them. As a matter of fact men would throw themselves under a bus just to get these ladies to notice them. LOL!
I totally agree that no one should dominate another human being, you address your boss with Mr. so you should address the rubbish collector with Mr. as well and don’t allow your trash to spill out onto the sidewalk where he would have to pick it up. And always say please and thank you to children and talk to them with respect and honesty. (hint: baby talk is not necessary unless you want them to talk that way too.) :)
I totally agree that no one should dominate another human being, you address your boss with Mr. so you should address the rubbish collector with Mr. as well and don’t allow your trash to spill out onto the sidewalk where he would have to pick it up. And always say please and thank you to children and talk to them with respect and honesty. (hint: baby talk is not necessary unless you want them to talk that way too.) :)
(Global Perspectives)
@Nuya
You please pay a visit to India.I will take you to my village.You must have read in your progressive literature that rural women in India are the exploited lot.
You will be glad to notice that even though they are less educated they are far more progressive than urban women in league with borrowed ideals!
Despite being trapped in all sorts of problems,they not only rise above any crisis but are ready to go to any extent to preserve the value based patterns,leading to stability and harmony.Let me make it very sure neither husbands nor mother in law have the courage to tame these real progressive wives of my village!
Anyway, it’s very clear that outside world loves to portray Indian rural and urban women as exploited lot as if their own women are living in some sort of paradise.
You please pay a visit to India.I will take you to my village.You must have read in your progressive literature that rural women in India are the exploited lot.
You will be glad to notice that even though they are less educated they are far more progressive than urban women in league with borrowed ideals!
Despite being trapped in all sorts of problems,they not only rise above any crisis but are ready to go to any extent to preserve the value based patterns,leading to stability and harmony.Let me make it very sure neither husbands nor mother in law have the courage to tame these real progressive wives of my village!
Anyway, it’s very clear that outside world loves to portray Indian rural and urban women as exploited lot as if their own women are living in some sort of paradise.
(Local Perspectives)
@Nuya
”Using a person for a maid is not a value, it is a disgrace”
When a mother does chores for her children do you call it slavery?? cooking..washing..cleaning their room etc...its her duty. When it comes to married couple…A wife doesn’t have any duty towards husband? Why is it often called slavery? When a grown up girl does some chores like house keeping, helping Mom in cooking , doing her own laundry etc at her home before marriage its okay (Even if she is holding a Phd.), but the same tasks if she do at her husbands house its slavery/torture… It don’t make any sense ..
”Using a person for a maid is not a value, it is a disgrace”
When a mother does chores for her children do you call it slavery?? cooking..washing..cleaning their room etc...its her duty. When it comes to married couple…A wife doesn’t have any duty towards husband? Why is it often called slavery? When a grown up girl does some chores like house keeping, helping Mom in cooking , doing her own laundry etc at her home before marriage its okay (Even if she is holding a Phd.), but the same tasks if she do at her husbands house its slavery/torture… It don’t make any sense ..
(Global Perspectives)
@Maya,
Doing work for others is not slavery. But the attitude of the receiver is what makes it like one. If you help your mom, she reciprocates with genuine affection, but the in-laws take it as their birth right. That’s what makes it appear like slavery. There are in-laws who reciprocate with true love and affection, and they are the morally educated ones.
Doing work for others is not slavery. But the attitude of the receiver is what makes it like one. If you help your mom, she reciprocates with genuine affection, but the in-laws take it as their birth right. That’s what makes it appear like slavery. There are in-laws who reciprocate with true love and affection, and they are the morally educated ones.
(Local Perspectives)
@Maya
Yea, what Leena said!
That and helping someone do something is not the same as doing it for them.
Here we do the stuff together, nothing is one person’s duty alone, And no money changes hands (dowry) , no one expects to be bribed into looking after their own wife.
Yea, what Leena said!
That and helping someone do something is not the same as doing it for them.
Here we do the stuff together, nothing is one person’s duty alone, And no money changes hands (dowry) , no one expects to be bribed into looking after their own wife.
(Global Perspectives)
”””””its their birth right to enjoy her services.”””””
SAY WHAT!!! Ok, somebody explain this to me?
I was being factious when I said slave but that sounds like brides are really indentured servants. Do you mean that they actually live in the same house with the in-laws? That they are the maids for a whole family and not just for the husband? Holy CRAP! No wonder women decided to revolt!
SAY WHAT!!! Ok, somebody explain this to me?
I was being factious when I said slave but that sounds like brides are really indentured servants. Do you mean that they actually live in the same house with the in-laws? That they are the maids for a whole family and not just for the husband? Holy CRAP! No wonder women decided to revolt!
(Global Perspectives)
Dear Leena, thanks for the quick response.
When I first read your article, I became very agitated at even the thought of someone taking advantage of someone just because they were uneducated. My pulse raced, my ears got red and it felt like my hair was on fire when I saw the line...”We have raised the status of women from the dumb, homely and uneducated...” It was like an echo from the battered women’s shelter where I do volunteer work. Almost all of the women have mentioned being told they were dumb or ugly or fat by the men who abuse them and/or by their families. Even though they are battered and bruised,they don’t come in on their own, someone brings them, usually a police woman. Most of them never finished high school and if they can read it is not very well. They don’t seem to have many interests beyond TV shows so it makes it difficult to start conversations since I don’t watch TV much. I do try to watch some of the shows they talk about from time to time. It is much better after they have been there awhile, they are not so frightened and the people who run the shelter take them places and do things with them so they have more to talk about about. I really love it when they tell me about things they have learned or something they read in a magazine. They really seem to come to life. Some of them stay bitter about what happened to them but many turn out to be very courageous, personable and talented.
The reason I am telling you this is because abusive men look for ”dumb, homely, uneducated” women that they can dominate. It is not about culture or conservativeness or values, it is about power and control...plain and simple. The less control a man has over his own life, the more force he will exhort on the weaker ones around him, the women and children. The more perfect, quiet, helpful, and agreeable she tries to be, the more he will demand, she can never be perfect enough to please him. These narratives about in-laws are a clue to why the men are behaving the way the do...they don’t have any control over their own lives...their families have the control. Just an observation about why all women should get an education and cultivate their interests and talents. It will make them a more enjoyable companion for a good man and a less likely target for a bad man.
When I first read your article, I became very agitated at even the thought of someone taking advantage of someone just because they were uneducated. My pulse raced, my ears got red and it felt like my hair was on fire when I saw the line...”We have raised the status of women from the dumb, homely and uneducated...” It was like an echo from the battered women’s shelter where I do volunteer work. Almost all of the women have mentioned being told they were dumb or ugly or fat by the men who abuse them and/or by their families. Even though they are battered and bruised,they don’t come in on their own, someone brings them, usually a police woman. Most of them never finished high school and if they can read it is not very well. They don’t seem to have many interests beyond TV shows so it makes it difficult to start conversations since I don’t watch TV much. I do try to watch some of the shows they talk about from time to time. It is much better after they have been there awhile, they are not so frightened and the people who run the shelter take them places and do things with them so they have more to talk about about. I really love it when they tell me about things they have learned or something they read in a magazine. They really seem to come to life. Some of them stay bitter about what happened to them but many turn out to be very courageous, personable and talented.
The reason I am telling you this is because abusive men look for ”dumb, homely, uneducated” women that they can dominate. It is not about culture or conservativeness or values, it is about power and control...plain and simple. The less control a man has over his own life, the more force he will exhort on the weaker ones around him, the women and children. The more perfect, quiet, helpful, and agreeable she tries to be, the more he will demand, she can never be perfect enough to please him. These narratives about in-laws are a clue to why the men are behaving the way the do...they don’t have any control over their own lives...their families have the control. Just an observation about why all women should get an education and cultivate their interests and talents. It will make them a more enjoyable companion for a good man and a less likely target for a bad man.
(Global Perspectives)
Yes Nuya,
You’ve said it once more in the typical admirable Nuyan way! You are very correct when you say its only about power and control and not about culture or conservativeness. This is what a section of society is trying to do in the garb of tradition and values.
Let me tell you about dowry Nuya. In the ancient times, as girls moved out of parental home to establish themselves in their marital home, the father would give a part of his property to the girl that she was entitled to through inheritance.This was a gift given by the father with love and affection as she was parting from him. Something that he gave out his own will and pleasure.
But you see now how this beautiful indian custom has been modified to suit the ugly desires of the in-laws . They are demanding it from the father and made it a mandatory issue.
Morever, Nuya when you pay for a thing it belongs to you right ? But here you pay to become someone’s free commodity. Now isn’t that simply ridiculous ?
You’ve said it once more in the typical admirable Nuyan way! You are very correct when you say its only about power and control and not about culture or conservativeness. This is what a section of society is trying to do in the garb of tradition and values.
Let me tell you about dowry Nuya. In the ancient times, as girls moved out of parental home to establish themselves in their marital home, the father would give a part of his property to the girl that she was entitled to through inheritance.This was a gift given by the father with love and affection as she was parting from him. Something that he gave out his own will and pleasure.
But you see now how this beautiful indian custom has been modified to suit the ugly desires of the in-laws . They are demanding it from the father and made it a mandatory issue.
Morever, Nuya when you pay for a thing it belongs to you right ? But here you pay to become someone’s free commodity. Now isn’t that simply ridiculous ?
(Local Perspectives)
I kind of figured that dowry was supposed to be like a wedding gift, you know, pots & pans, sheets, towels, furniture, maybe some money to pay the dues on an apartment, stuff like that. It cost a lot to set up house but I didn’t figure it was meant as upkeep for the rest of her life. One of the first stories I read on instablogs was something about dowry harassment and at first I thought the guy didn’t like the wedding gift, (Which would be rude to mention..if you get a gift you don’t like... you say thank you, then take it home and put it in the closet...I have this huge vase with cherries and lemons painted all over it...it has been in the attic for 20 years hehehehe)
anyway, you can imagine my surprise to learn the ’gift’ was tens of thousands of dollars and more was being demanded like blackmail!
Instead of it being a gift to the girl so that she could get the necessities of homemaking it ended up being a payment to the man......How did that happen?
Yes, that does sound ridiculous to me, the way the articles made it sound was that the father was paying to get rid of the daughter because she cost too much to feed and could not provide an income for them in old age.
anyway, you can imagine my surprise to learn the ’gift’ was tens of thousands of dollars and more was being demanded like blackmail!
Instead of it being a gift to the girl so that she could get the necessities of homemaking it ended up being a payment to the man......How did that happen?
Yes, that does sound ridiculous to me, the way the articles made it sound was that the father was paying to get rid of the daughter because she cost too much to feed and could not provide an income for them in old age.
(Global Perspectives)
I know I being devils advocate here, I just can’t keep my mouth shut when people wrongly misinterpret the situation to their favor.
Education is not the license to disrespect in-laws. It’s the prejudiced mind of the Modern gals that their in-laws are so outdated that they can’t understand what you say. If they make a deliberate attempt to convince them they will change, of course only with the support of her husband. If he is not cooperating, nothing can be done.
Do you really think all educated girls have problem with their in-laws? What about these illiterate girls who commit suicide because of their sufferings in their husband’s house. Their daughter in laws is not educated then why should have a problem with them.
Its not education, it’s your mindset. If you want to have a happy and peaceful married life you should compromise/adjust. If you happy your husband is happy, if he is happy the whole family is happy.
In arranged marriages, they should first learn the formula to win their in-laws /husband and influence them with their own attitude. For that you need to do some homework and proper upbringing.
Education is not the license to disrespect in-laws. It’s the prejudiced mind of the Modern gals that their in-laws are so outdated that they can’t understand what you say. If they make a deliberate attempt to convince them they will change, of course only with the support of her husband. If he is not cooperating, nothing can be done.
Do you really think all educated girls have problem with their in-laws? What about these illiterate girls who commit suicide because of their sufferings in their husband’s house. Their daughter in laws is not educated then why should have a problem with them.
Its not education, it’s your mindset. If you want to have a happy and peaceful married life you should compromise/adjust. If you happy your husband is happy, if he is happy the whole family is happy.
In arranged marriages, they should first learn the formula to win their in-laws /husband and influence them with their own attitude. For that you need to do some homework and proper upbringing.
(Global Perspectives)
@Maya
I appreciate your views from the core of my heart.It’s not that easy to stand apart from the crowd.
”Education is not the license to disrespect in-laws.”
...Sadly, it has become a mean to humiliate the in-laws and husband.
You have also referred to ”mindset”.How is mindset formed?
There are many laws to take note of misdeeds of husbands/men.How many laws are there to take note of misdeeds of women or,for that matter,how many laws have been framed keeping in mind that women too are governed by evil/criminal traits ? Had that not been the case,we would not have seen rise in fake cases filed by the so-called educated brides ?
I feel education can be an effective tool to bring desirable changes in one’s mindset.However,the moot question is that when our present age education is aimed at heightening our individualistic tendencies and is making all of us the worshipers of materialism can then we ever hope of achieving stability within our homes ?
What about the ”mindset” born out of current education system ?I think it’s only producing ”educated fools” who are more interested in living self-centered lives and,therefore,least interested in compromises or adjustments.
I appreciate your views from the core of my heart.It’s not that easy to stand apart from the crowd.
”Education is not the license to disrespect in-laws.”
...Sadly, it has become a mean to humiliate the in-laws and husband.
You have also referred to ”mindset”.How is mindset formed?
There are many laws to take note of misdeeds of husbands/men.How many laws are there to take note of misdeeds of women or,for that matter,how many laws have been framed keeping in mind that women too are governed by evil/criminal traits ? Had that not been the case,we would not have seen rise in fake cases filed by the so-called educated brides ?
I feel education can be an effective tool to bring desirable changes in one’s mindset.However,the moot question is that when our present age education is aimed at heightening our individualistic tendencies and is making all of us the worshipers of materialism can then we ever hope of achieving stability within our homes ?
What about the ”mindset” born out of current education system ?I think it’s only producing ”educated fools” who are more interested in living self-centered lives and,therefore,least interested in compromises or adjustments.
(Local Perspectives)
Mindsets are ultimately a matter of your education which in its true sense is different from academic qualifications and literacy. It is about your moral standards and outlook. A person might inherit that by their upbringing or by learning by watching the world around them , which a girl develops when she goes to school and mixes with different people and reads about the world around her.
I have already given an example of an ideal bahu in my previous comment addressed to everybody. So you should not be asking the question if all educated women have problems with their in-laws. Illiterate women are committing suicide not because they lack in academic qualification, but because the in-laws are desperately less qualified in their moral education.
I quote your words “If you want to have a happy and peaceful married life you should compromise/adjust.” This is what I meant by a mute baby lamb. Don’t think or question and be happy.
Lastly, I never thought there is a formula to win/husband or in-laws. I thought sincerely loving the husband and respecting the in-laws will give adequate reciprocation. I’ve heard other women also talking about “formulae” to win in-laws and influence them. Now I think I need to be educated on those . hehehe !
I have already given an example of an ideal bahu in my previous comment addressed to everybody. So you should not be asking the question if all educated women have problems with their in-laws. Illiterate women are committing suicide not because they lack in academic qualification, but because the in-laws are desperately less qualified in their moral education.
I quote your words “If you want to have a happy and peaceful married life you should compromise/adjust.” This is what I meant by a mute baby lamb. Don’t think or question and be happy.
Lastly, I never thought there is a formula to win/husband or in-laws. I thought sincerely loving the husband and respecting the in-laws will give adequate reciprocation. I’ve heard other women also talking about “formulae” to win in-laws and influence them. Now I think I need to be educated on those . hehehe !
(Local Perspectives)
”Education is not the license to disrespect in-laws.”
Its rather you who is distoriting things in your favor. Agian, I’m telling you this post is about those conservative in-laws in whose hands the DIL is suffering even today. There are plenty of them in our country. You say that they are disrespecting whem they don’t take cruelty like a mute animal and ask for their rights.
Its rather you who is distoriting things in your favor. Agian, I’m telling you this post is about those conservative in-laws in whose hands the DIL is suffering even today. There are plenty of them in our country. You say that they are disrespecting whem they don’t take cruelty like a mute animal and ask for their rights.
(Local Perspectives)
Life is about compromises and adjustments, Arivnd? Is life worth living that way? The educated girl is not asking for reverse domination, she is asking for a live and let live attitude from the in-laws. After all, we have just one life. Is it worth living by one person dominating over the other ? Why not live yor life peacefully and let me live mine ?
(Local Perspectives)
@Leena
The Nuya’s inability to grasp the position of Indian bride in Indian society is quite understandable.She belongs to a different world and ,therefore,she can never be aware of the life governed by rituals and samskaras.
But what has happened to you ?You not only belong to this part of world but also a very sensible lady.What’s the need to comment in such an ambiguous manner? I know you are bit bothered over strained relationship between girl and her in-laws but that should not let your prejudices play mess with your genuine concerns.Are you more interested in highlighting the woes of newly wed girl or are you more interested in painting Indian society in wrong colours?
Yes,there is tug-of-war between some girls and their in-laws but then that’s not the reason enough to conclude that
there is absence of ”live and let live attitude from the in-laws”.Or,that the relationship between ”Saas” and ”Bahu” is tale of dominance.
You are talking in ”your” and ”mine” fashion,forgetting that whenever there is heightened consciousness of ME and MINE there can never be any sort of relationship.
Life is name of compromises.Show me an individual who has never entered in compromises! Why so much hue and cry is being raised over few adjustments made by the girl ?Is that subordination of one’s right or something humiliating? Why do you forget that mother-in-law is also an elderly person and therefore has right to dictate terms?
The logical fallacy committed by you is that you are treating everybody as guilty for the crime committed by few.
Stop talking in yours and mine fashion in a land that has given rise to host of people who have given away their lives to make others happy.
You are more interested in rights rather than duties.A society dependent on rights is bound to shatter into places if it has no scope for duties,adjustments,compromises and self-sacrifices.One more interested in rights etc. should move to Nuya’s land!There get married many times,get divorced many times and later live your life as a single woman with nothing else but your rights !
The Nuya’s inability to grasp the position of Indian bride in Indian society is quite understandable.She belongs to a different world and ,therefore,she can never be aware of the life governed by rituals and samskaras.
But what has happened to you ?You not only belong to this part of world but also a very sensible lady.What’s the need to comment in such an ambiguous manner? I know you are bit bothered over strained relationship between girl and her in-laws but that should not let your prejudices play mess with your genuine concerns.Are you more interested in highlighting the woes of newly wed girl or are you more interested in painting Indian society in wrong colours?
Yes,there is tug-of-war between some girls and their in-laws but then that’s not the reason enough to conclude that
there is absence of ”live and let live attitude from the in-laws”.Or,that the relationship between ”Saas” and ”Bahu” is tale of dominance.
You are talking in ”your” and ”mine” fashion,forgetting that whenever there is heightened consciousness of ME and MINE there can never be any sort of relationship.
Life is name of compromises.Show me an individual who has never entered in compromises! Why so much hue and cry is being raised over few adjustments made by the girl ?Is that subordination of one’s right or something humiliating? Why do you forget that mother-in-law is also an elderly person and therefore has right to dictate terms?
The logical fallacy committed by you is that you are treating everybody as guilty for the crime committed by few.
Stop talking in yours and mine fashion in a land that has given rise to host of people who have given away their lives to make others happy.
You are more interested in rights rather than duties.A society dependent on rights is bound to shatter into places if it has no scope for duties,adjustments,compromises and self-sacrifices.One more interested in rights etc. should move to Nuya’s land!There get married many times,get divorced many times and later live your life as a single woman with nothing else but your rights !
(Local Perspectives)
Don’t listen to him Leena, he is just trying to make sure that he gets a miserable slave of his own one day. He is still insisting that only females adjust and make compromises. He is still saying that it is better for women to live each day wishing they were dead than to rock his macho boat. Who will wash his feet? Who will bathe him and lay out his clothes? Who will bring him dinner cooked exactly how he wants it? Who will bow to his every demand? who will run to wait on him hand and foot? And even better he doesn’t have to pay for any of those services because he can just have her father to provide for her forever.
Hey you can’t blame him, every one would like to have a fully paid robot servant.
Hey you can’t blame him, every one would like to have a fully paid robot servant.
(Global Perspectives)
@ Leena
I hold a masters degree, I was born and brought up in a city, I am married to a guy who was brought up in a small town, but very well educated. His parents are really simple people. My parents were in 50’s when I got married and they were in 70’s. I never knew how to behave with elderly people because my parents were like my friends I was free to tell anything to them.
But I never found anything questionable in his house. I could easily convince them in anything I do. They never seen a Hindi or English movie in their life (We are from south) I never saw any serials in my life..slowly they started seeing Hindi/English movies along with me....though I had to translate in between..I started watching serials just for giving them company. So if I insisted on watching star movies from the beginning then the situation might have been worse.
I don’t have any complains about them till date...and vice versa
I hold a masters degree, I was born and brought up in a city, I am married to a guy who was brought up in a small town, but very well educated. His parents are really simple people. My parents were in 50’s when I got married and they were in 70’s. I never knew how to behave with elderly people because my parents were like my friends I was free to tell anything to them.
But I never found anything questionable in his house. I could easily convince them in anything I do. They never seen a Hindi or English movie in their life (We are from south) I never saw any serials in my life..slowly they started seeing Hindi/English movies along with me....though I had to translate in between..I started watching serials just for giving them company. So if I insisted on watching star movies from the beginning then the situation might have been worse.
I don’t have any complains about them till date...and vice versa
(Global Perspectives)
.Maya,
God bless you and keep you happy! You are lucky in getting good and understanding in-laws, but many girls are not as lucky as you and its on their behalf that I choose to speak. This post is about them
God bless you and keep you happy! You are lucky in getting good and understanding in-laws, but many girls are not as lucky as you and its on their behalf that I choose to speak. This post is about them
(Local Perspectives)
@ leena
I do agree there are many in-laws like what you have mentioned above. But it can be corrected to a great extend with a little self rectification in our own attitude.
I don’t think such in-laws are not majority in this society. ..probably because if I take out of 10 girls I know (my friends, cousins) only 2 of them having problem with their in-laws, rest of them are living a happy happily.
I do agree there are many in-laws like what you have mentioned above. But it can be corrected to a great extend with a little self rectification in our own attitude.
I don’t think such in-laws are not majority in this society. ..probably because if I take out of 10 girls I know (my friends, cousins) only 2 of them having problem with their in-laws, rest of them are living a happy happily.
(Global Perspectives)
I agree, but you can rectify only those that are rectifiable, but how can you rectify if its out of the hands of the DIL? Do you think its the girls’ fault when they are viewed as money minting machines and their parents are insulted, as though they are inferior?
You and I belong to elite or upper middle class society. But this kind of exploitation is very much prevalent in the lower middle and poor income groups, which form the majority. Even in the elite society, I know of, these cases are quite frequent.
You and I belong to elite or upper middle class society. But this kind of exploitation is very much prevalent in the lower middle and poor income groups, which form the majority. Even in the elite society, I know of, these cases are quite frequent.
(Local Perspectives)
I thought your article is about the educating girls in the upper middle class society.
If its not rectifiable, just quit. Why cling to someone/some family if they dont need/respect you.
If its not rectifiable, just quit. Why cling to someone/some family if they dont need/respect you.
(Global Perspectives)
Maya,
What you say is correct that we should quit if they don’t respect us. But do you know some women don’t have anywhere else to go and they just put up with it day in and day out. Simply because they are not aware of their rights. By quitting do you teach the culprit a lesson.
My article is about educated girls but I’m not relating education to class because even a poor village girl when sent to school will gain knowledge and just might challenge some of the conservative views.
What you say is correct that we should quit if they don’t respect us. But do you know some women don’t have anywhere else to go and they just put up with it day in and day out. Simply because they are not aware of their rights. By quitting do you teach the culprit a lesson.
My article is about educated girls but I’m not relating education to class because even a poor village girl when sent to school will gain knowledge and just might challenge some of the conservative views.
(Local Perspectives)
Hello Arvind,
I am trying to understand, really I am. Please forgive me, I am an American, I have no culture or tradition. So if you don’t mind explaining it to me, I would greatly appreciate it. Start with this..
”You are little aware of the fact that brides are given due respect in Indian homes”
What is due respect? Please give some examples that I might be able to relate to.
”Mother-in-law in an Indian home enjoy commanding position.”
Ok, I ain’t touching that one with a 10 foot pole! The stereotype of the Bossy Mother-in-law is easy enough to imagine.
”Anyway, I read somewhere that your mother too struggled to make you people very happy? Why do you see it as something glorious when the very same attitude depicted by Indian lady appears to be indicative of her slavery?”
It is very different... my mother had a choice, she had control over her own life, she was an adult and she was treated like an adult, she never had to ask permission for anything. For our family, marriage is between a husband and wife, no one tells you who to marry or when, relatives visit and help each other, but they don’t live together. They don’t generally interfere in each others business either.
”First be aware of the fact females are not exploited but given due respect.”
You say that, but there is absolutely no evidence of that anywhere. Thousands upon thousands of anecdotal records, historical accounts, international statistics, reports from NGOs etc.... separately, they might not look like much to you, but taken all together they clearly point to something damn close to exploitation.
And I don’t doubt for a minute that the problem is being worked on and I know from the history of every country that went through it already, it doesn’t get fixed over night. I also know that there are elements in society that don’t want it to be fixed...EVER!
So I want to know what steps are being taken to right the wrongs? How much progress has been made so far?
I don’t know what you are calling progressive literature, but history and women and gender studies isn’t exactly a new concept but I never rely on a single source for my research so I also got articles from on-line newspapers, journals, statistics, religious texts etc. and I watched a bunch of videos of news shows from India. BUT, I would also like hear it from real flesh and blood people.
Why do I care you might ask? I have said it before and I will say it again, when 1 person suffers, we all suffer. And I was born with an insatiable need for information.
I am trying to understand, really I am. Please forgive me, I am an American, I have no culture or tradition. So if you don’t mind explaining it to me, I would greatly appreciate it. Start with this..
”You are little aware of the fact that brides are given due respect in Indian homes”
What is due respect? Please give some examples that I might be able to relate to.
”Mother-in-law in an Indian home enjoy commanding position.”
Ok, I ain’t touching that one with a 10 foot pole! The stereotype of the Bossy Mother-in-law is easy enough to imagine.
”Anyway, I read somewhere that your mother too struggled to make you people very happy? Why do you see it as something glorious when the very same attitude depicted by Indian lady appears to be indicative of her slavery?”
It is very different... my mother had a choice, she had control over her own life, she was an adult and she was treated like an adult, she never had to ask permission for anything. For our family, marriage is between a husband and wife, no one tells you who to marry or when, relatives visit and help each other, but they don’t live together. They don’t generally interfere in each others business either.
”First be aware of the fact females are not exploited but given due respect.”
You say that, but there is absolutely no evidence of that anywhere. Thousands upon thousands of anecdotal records, historical accounts, international statistics, reports from NGOs etc.... separately, they might not look like much to you, but taken all together they clearly point to something damn close to exploitation.
And I don’t doubt for a minute that the problem is being worked on and I know from the history of every country that went through it already, it doesn’t get fixed over night. I also know that there are elements in society that don’t want it to be fixed...EVER!
So I want to know what steps are being taken to right the wrongs? How much progress has been made so far?
I don’t know what you are calling progressive literature, but history and women and gender studies isn’t exactly a new concept but I never rely on a single source for my research so I also got articles from on-line newspapers, journals, statistics, religious texts etc. and I watched a bunch of videos of news shows from India. BUT, I would also like hear it from real flesh and blood people.
Why do I care you might ask? I have said it before and I will say it again, when 1 person suffers, we all suffer. And I was born with an insatiable need for information.
(Global Perspectives)
@Nuya
It’s not easy to answer you via one-liners.You know lot of people are not very happy over my ability to post long comments..hehe
What is due respect? Please give some examples that I might be able to relate to.
She is hailed as ”Bahurani” or ”Grihalakshmi” or ”Ghar Ki Lakshmi”.In other words,she is the carrier of attributes related with prosperity.It is she who brings peace and prosperity.This concept has taken a backseat due to rise of wrong set of values but we are largely governed by this definition of Indian bride.Let me inform you that the burden to be responsible towards your life partner is not only the job of wife.Man too has its own share of roles.It’s so beautifully depicted in ”Saptapadi”.
Have a look at the link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saptapadi
In nutshell, right from birth to death we are governed by Samskaras.Marriage here is not only aimed at bringing two people close for physical union but also an attempt to give rise to better set of values.
”Ok, I ain’t touching that one with a 10 foot pole! The stereotype of the Bossy Mother-in-law is easy enough to imagine.”
The problem with you Nuya is that you rush to conclusions and that too with wrong set of information.Please deconstruct your ”mindset” in light of newer disclosures.I need to restate what Maya has said that not all mother-in-laws are of ”bossy”nature.I feel that problem arise because both of them belong to different generations.That’s generation gap and could be easily solved by healthy compromises from both the sides.
”It is very different... my mother had a choice, she had control over her own life, she was an adult and she was treated like an adult, she never had to ask permission for anything.”
It’s not very different here either !You don’t realize that because all the time you are viewing through the wrong lens.Here too women whether in form of wife,daughter or mother-in-law etc. have full control.Or,how else we have given rise to so many ”Joru Ka Ghulams”..Sorry !It’s only in lighter vain.The reality is that women is controller of the affairs at home in India ,to an extent that most of the husbands are a happy lot when women moves to her parents’ home for a brief period!
You please come to India and have a first hand experience of what’s taking place in ideal Indian home.I am sure then you will never ever say that women are trapped in any sort of slavery!On the contrary,it’s men who are all the time trapped in all sorts of problems.A command of Indian wife is more dangerous than FATWA issued by the Muslim body...hehe
”You say that, but there is absolutely no evidence of that anywhere.”
I think we had discussed this issue earlier and there has been exchange of evidences in this regard elsewhere.I have already informed that women in India always enjoyed an exalted position.. Yes,deterioration occurred but then there are number of factors behind that downfall in stature of women.
****************************************
MORE EVIDENCES:
”Women enjoyed far greater freedom in the Vedic period than in later India. She had more to say in the choice of her mate than the forms of marriage might suggest. She appeared freely at feasts and dances, and joined with men in religious sacrifice. She could study, and like Gargi, engage in philosophical disputation. If she was left a widow there was no restrictions upon her remarriage.”
Source:
______________________-
Will Durant - Story of Civilization: Our Oriental Heritage
“Among the many societies that can be found in the world, we have seen that some of the most venerating regard for women has been found in Vedic culture. The Vedic tradition has held a high regard for the qualities of women, and has retained the greatest respect within its tradition “
Source -Stephen Knapp- Women in Vedic Culture.
_________________________
”Women were held in higher respect in India than in other ancient countries, and the Epics and old literature of India assign a higher position to them than the epics and literature of ancient Greece. Hindu women enjoyed some rights of property from the Vedic Age, took a share in social and religious rites, and were sometimes distinguished by their learning. The absolute seclusion of women in India was unknown in ancient times.”
Source:
R. C. Dutt - The Civilization of
India
____________________________
Position of Women (Page 227), (Manu Smriti, 3.55-5; 9.3-7, 11, 26) ”
Women must be honored and adorned by their fathers, brothers, husbands,
and brothers-in-law who desire great good fortune. Where women, verily,
are honored, there the gods rejoice; where however, they are not
honored, there all sacred rites prove fruitless. Where the female
relations live in grief - that family soon perishes completely;
****************************************
”So I want to know what steps are being taken to right the wrongs? How much progress has been made so far?”
....Many amendments have been made in Indian Hindu Marriage Act.The DV Act or the introduction of anti-dowry laws are enough proof to indicate that so many changes have taken place.There are laws to stop harassment at the workplace etc.Above all,there are hundreds of NGOs ,Women organizations are there to ensure speedy redressal of cases pertaining to them.Ban on child marriages along with ban on Sati practices were brought in force much earlier.
I hope this much is sufficient.Sorry! I must tender my apology to the readers to make them read long comments but bear with me.
It’s not my habit to avoid detailed and factual answers along with logic when likes of Nuya are arguing with me.And that’s bound to make the answers long.I can provide short answers in lighter vein but that will be a great injustice to the issue at hand although it makes some readers very happy.
Lastly, I know well that it’s not going to kill the ignorance of Nuya.She is bound to ask me same questions but in a different way on some other post sooner or later :-)
It’s not easy to answer you via one-liners.You know lot of people are not very happy over my ability to post long comments..hehe
What is due respect? Please give some examples that I might be able to relate to.
She is hailed as ”Bahurani” or ”Grihalakshmi” or ”Ghar Ki Lakshmi”.In other words,she is the carrier of attributes related with prosperity.It is she who brings peace and prosperity.This concept has taken a backseat due to rise of wrong set of values but we are largely governed by this definition of Indian bride.Let me inform you that the burden to be responsible towards your life partner is not only the job of wife.Man too has its own share of roles.It’s so beautifully depicted in ”Saptapadi”.
Have a look at the link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saptapadi
In nutshell, right from birth to death we are governed by Samskaras.Marriage here is not only aimed at bringing two people close for physical union but also an attempt to give rise to better set of values.
”Ok, I ain’t touching that one with a 10 foot pole! The stereotype of the Bossy Mother-in-law is easy enough to imagine.”
The problem with you Nuya is that you rush to conclusions and that too with wrong set of information.Please deconstruct your ”mindset” in light of newer disclosures.I need to restate what Maya has said that not all mother-in-laws are of ”bossy”nature.I feel that problem arise because both of them belong to different generations.That’s generation gap and could be easily solved by healthy compromises from both the sides.
”It is very different... my mother had a choice, she had control over her own life, she was an adult and she was treated like an adult, she never had to ask permission for anything.”
It’s not very different here either !You don’t realize that because all the time you are viewing through the wrong lens.Here too women whether in form of wife,daughter or mother-in-law etc. have full control.Or,how else we have given rise to so many ”Joru Ka Ghulams”..Sorry !It’s only in lighter vain.The reality is that women is controller of the affairs at home in India ,to an extent that most of the husbands are a happy lot when women moves to her parents’ home for a brief period!
You please come to India and have a first hand experience of what’s taking place in ideal Indian home.I am sure then you will never ever say that women are trapped in any sort of slavery!On the contrary,it’s men who are all the time trapped in all sorts of problems.A command of Indian wife is more dangerous than FATWA issued by the Muslim body...hehe
”You say that, but there is absolutely no evidence of that anywhere.”
I think we had discussed this issue earlier and there has been exchange of evidences in this regard elsewhere.I have already informed that women in India always enjoyed an exalted position.. Yes,deterioration occurred but then there are number of factors behind that downfall in stature of women.
****************************************
MORE EVIDENCES:
”Women enjoyed far greater freedom in the Vedic period than in later India. She had more to say in the choice of her mate than the forms of marriage might suggest. She appeared freely at feasts and dances, and joined with men in religious sacrifice. She could study, and like Gargi, engage in philosophical disputation. If she was left a widow there was no restrictions upon her remarriage.”
Source:
______________________-
Will Durant - Story of Civilization: Our Oriental Heritage
“Among the many societies that can be found in the world, we have seen that some of the most venerating regard for women has been found in Vedic culture. The Vedic tradition has held a high regard for the qualities of women, and has retained the greatest respect within its tradition “
Source -Stephen Knapp- Women in Vedic Culture.
_________________________
”Women were held in higher respect in India than in other ancient countries, and the Epics and old literature of India assign a higher position to them than the epics and literature of ancient Greece. Hindu women enjoyed some rights of property from the Vedic Age, took a share in social and religious rites, and were sometimes distinguished by their learning. The absolute seclusion of women in India was unknown in ancient times.”
Source:
R. C. Dutt - The Civilization of
India
____________________________
Position of Women (Page 227), (Manu Smriti, 3.55-5; 9.3-7, 11, 26) ”
Women must be honored and adorned by their fathers, brothers, husbands,
and brothers-in-law who desire great good fortune. Where women, verily,
are honored, there the gods rejoice; where however, they are not
honored, there all sacred rites prove fruitless. Where the female
relations live in grief - that family soon perishes completely;
****************************************
”So I want to know what steps are being taken to right the wrongs? How much progress has been made so far?”
....Many amendments have been made in Indian Hindu Marriage Act.The DV Act or the introduction of anti-dowry laws are enough proof to indicate that so many changes have taken place.There are laws to stop harassment at the workplace etc.Above all,there are hundreds of NGOs ,Women organizations are there to ensure speedy redressal of cases pertaining to them.Ban on child marriages along with ban on Sati practices were brought in force much earlier.
I hope this much is sufficient.Sorry! I must tender my apology to the readers to make them read long comments but bear with me.
It’s not my habit to avoid detailed and factual answers along with logic when likes of Nuya are arguing with me.And that’s bound to make the answers long.I can provide short answers in lighter vein but that will be a great injustice to the issue at hand although it makes some readers very happy.
Lastly, I know well that it’s not going to kill the ignorance of Nuya.She is bound to ask me same questions but in a different way on some other post sooner or later :-)
(Local Perspectives)
Hi Kalpana,
Thanks for bringing in a new point “how many guys accept gals family as his family. The whole family have to work out to make a marraige successful?”
If the guy is asked to live with his in-laws they will understand what adjustment means and what it takes to adjust. Men and their family behave like bosses when it comes to the girl’s family. As you said it should be a both way process to make a marriage successful.
Also, as you said these in-laws don’t want to give the newcomer a chance to learn. A young girl stepping out of the secure shell of her parents feels insecure in a new environment. The pain of detachment from parents and a carefree life and the acceptance of a new home create an emotional overload on the girl. Its then that she desperately searches for love, affection and security. If the members of the new home start with biases, superiority complex and an attitude to dominate her, she is bound to misunderstand them.
Thanks for bringing in a new point “how many guys accept gals family as his family. The whole family have to work out to make a marraige successful?”
If the guy is asked to live with his in-laws they will understand what adjustment means and what it takes to adjust. Men and their family behave like bosses when it comes to the girl’s family. As you said it should be a both way process to make a marriage successful.
Also, as you said these in-laws don’t want to give the newcomer a chance to learn. A young girl stepping out of the secure shell of her parents feels insecure in a new environment. The pain of detachment from parents and a carefree life and the acceptance of a new home create an emotional overload on the girl. Its then that she desperately searches for love, affection and security. If the members of the new home start with biases, superiority complex and an attitude to dominate her, she is bound to misunderstand them.
(Local Perspectives)
Leena, One of your comments is repeated 3 times. You may wish to write to the webadmin person to remove the ”repeated ones”.
As Maya said, several in laws treat their daughters in law as their own daughters and love them and so the new brides treat the new place as their parents home — and treat the in laws as their parents, siblings where they do not have any room for unhappiness.
As Maya said, several in laws treat their daughters in law as their own daughters and love them and so the new brides treat the new place as their parents home — and treat the in laws as their parents, siblings where they do not have any room for unhappiness.
(Global Perspectives)
Hello,
Mr. Chinni,
Thanks for the observation. There was a networking problem and it happened. I will remind them tomorrow as today happens to be a Sunday.
As for your comment on the subject I agree with you and Maya 100 %. I wish it were like that with every home. I’m talking on behalf of those who homes which have a distrubed family owing to conservative views.
Mr. Chinni,
Thanks for the observation. There was a networking problem and it happened. I will remind them tomorrow as today happens to be a Sunday.
As for your comment on the subject I agree with you and Maya 100 %. I wish it were like that with every home. I’m talking on behalf of those who homes which have a distrubed family owing to conservative views.
(Local Perspectives)
Sorry for addressing you as Mr. Chinni. Your picture didn’t get downloaded while I was making the previous comment. :)
(Local Perspectives)
Well written, for a marriage to be successful, adjustments should come from both sides in equal measures. The concerned parites should understand that this is a two-way traffic.
(Local Perspectives)
Thank you Usha.
If I’ve understood you right, you mean to say that both parties should adjust equally and its not that only the bahu who has to make all the adjustments! Correct?
If I’ve understood you right, you mean to say that both parties should adjust equally and its not that only the bahu who has to make all the adjustments! Correct?
(Local Perspectives)
Perfectly right. Bahu alone making adjustments will take us nowhere. Our men still need to acknowledge a well placed and educated wife. It is all very well when they proudly display a highly qualified and well employed wife to their kith and kin. But when it comes to actual adjustments they lag far behind.
(Local Perspectives)
Perfectly right. Bahu alone making adjustments will take us nowhere. Our men still need to acknowledge a well placed and educated wife. It is all very well when they proudly display a highly qualified and well employed wife to their kith and kin. But when it comes to actual adjustments they lag far behind.
(Local Perspectives)
Exactly Usha,
I understand. Wife’s qualifications are show case material for many men ! I think the choice of making the degrees showcase material should be left to the wife unless there are some real problems in the household.
I understand. Wife’s qualifications are show case material for many men ! I think the choice of making the degrees showcase material should be left to the wife unless there are some real problems in the household.
(Local Perspectives)
should move to Nuya’s land!
Yea Leena, sounds like a good idea, marry if you want, who you want and when you want, marry a man who adores you, one who stops on the side of the road to pick wild flowers because he knows you like them. Marry a man who will never stand for anyone to speak harshly to you, no matter who it is. Marry a man can’t wait to get home each day just to talk to you even after 30 years of marriage. Or like my grandparents holding hands at the breakfast table and still making each other laugh till their false teeth pop out after 60+ years of marriage.
Yea Leena, sounds like a good idea, marry if you want, who you want and when you want, marry a man who adores you, one who stops on the side of the road to pick wild flowers because he knows you like them. Marry a man who will never stand for anyone to speak harshly to you, no matter who it is. Marry a man can’t wait to get home each day just to talk to you even after 30 years of marriage. Or like my grandparents holding hands at the breakfast table and still making each other laugh till their false teeth pop out after 60+ years of marriage.
(Global Perspectives)
@Arvind,
Rituals and sanskaras have to be followed by everybody. That was how it was in ancient times. Women were more powerful. But that has been distorted and people are butchering women in the name of sanskaras and rituals.
Woes of newly wed girl? Don’t forget that when the 7 pheras are taken the man takes the entire responsibility of a girl by taking woes too.
This bahu harassment issue is an age old thing of Hindu culture. I am not the 1st person talking about it. The entire world knows about it. Had it been something happening to a minority, it wouldn’t have become an issue of prime social concern for generations. Of course there are some improvements, but its only because of change in attitude which has come through self education. MIL-DIL problem is present in various degrees in the majority of Indian society even to this day.
Nobody is complaining about sensible authority. And as you have seen its not only MIL but other members also dictating terms to DIL. A girl has to ask for her rights if she is being harassed. Otherwise she’ll become a nervous wreck.. Responsibilities, self -sacrifices, duties- why only from one member against a host of members ?
Live and let live is basic human tendency. By me and mine I did not mean, you to yourself and me to myself which I think you’ve understood by the statement. I meant unnecessary domination is not required becoz whereever there is domination, revolt is going to happen. Why not live together, but remove this domination. This will not only develop mutual respect but a strong bonding also.
You know what is disgusting is that Indians in Nuya land also are behaving in the same way. I have already given an example of that in one of my replies to Nuya. So its not about land or culture or tradition. As Nuya rightly pointed out, its only about control and domination. One section of society has got the social license to exercise control over another and they are taking advantage of it.
BTW, to escape all this maybe I can flee to Nuya land, but what about those hundreds of women who don’t have the resources to go to Nuya land? Should they suffer like lambs?
Rituals and sanskaras have to be followed by everybody. That was how it was in ancient times. Women were more powerful. But that has been distorted and people are butchering women in the name of sanskaras and rituals.
Woes of newly wed girl? Don’t forget that when the 7 pheras are taken the man takes the entire responsibility of a girl by taking woes too.
This bahu harassment issue is an age old thing of Hindu culture. I am not the 1st person talking about it. The entire world knows about it. Had it been something happening to a minority, it wouldn’t have become an issue of prime social concern for generations. Of course there are some improvements, but its only because of change in attitude which has come through self education. MIL-DIL problem is present in various degrees in the majority of Indian society even to this day.
Nobody is complaining about sensible authority. And as you have seen its not only MIL but other members also dictating terms to DIL. A girl has to ask for her rights if she is being harassed. Otherwise she’ll become a nervous wreck.. Responsibilities, self -sacrifices, duties- why only from one member against a host of members ?
Live and let live is basic human tendency. By me and mine I did not mean, you to yourself and me to myself which I think you’ve understood by the statement. I meant unnecessary domination is not required becoz whereever there is domination, revolt is going to happen. Why not live together, but remove this domination. This will not only develop mutual respect but a strong bonding also.
You know what is disgusting is that Indians in Nuya land also are behaving in the same way. I have already given an example of that in one of my replies to Nuya. So its not about land or culture or tradition. As Nuya rightly pointed out, its only about control and domination. One section of society has got the social license to exercise control over another and they are taking advantage of it.
BTW, to escape all this maybe I can flee to Nuya land, but what about those hundreds of women who don’t have the resources to go to Nuya land? Should they suffer like lambs?
(Local Perspectives)
Hi Nuya,
Here’s more in reply to Arvind’s comments:
LOL!
Nuya, let me tell you about these terms of due respect :
Bahurani( Bahu + Rani): DIL is the queen of the house . If she were treated as the queen of the house, Domestic Violence act would not have come into existence.
Grihalakhsmi or Ghar Ki Lakshmi : Griha(house) + Lakshmi(goddess of wealth) meaning she is the representative of family wealth. Do you know the price she has to pay for that title? She is held responsible for whatever wealth the family gets or looses, even though logically she is unconnected with it. If a man gets wealth due to her presence in the house he will praise her, but if he loses wealth out of his own mistakes and not any fault of hers, she will have to face the music. Haven’t you seen Deepa’s husband who blamed her for his foolishness and asked for divorce becoz his sister said that she brought bad luck? If we would have been largely governed by the correct usage of Bahurani, bride harassment would not have become an internationally known social issue.
“I feel that problem arise because both of them belong to different generations. That’s generation gap and could be easily solved by healthy compromises from both the sides.”
Haha ha Arvind,! thanks for realizing things so late. Bridging the generation gap is what I meant by EDUCATING the in-laws.
There are a lot more Mummy or Didi ka gulams than Joru ka Gulams. Man is peaceful when his wife moves over to her parents house. Mark these words Nuya !
Old is Gold ! Of course in the vedic period women were respected well and the customs were originally made with noble intentions. But see the way they have been distorted now. Dowry custom is an example of this. You know why? Because we are hanging between the old and new. We belong to nowhere. Ignorance and complete knowledge are bliss but we have half knowledge which is dangerous. We twisted our ancestral intentions to suit our necessities.
Here’s more in reply to Arvind’s comments:
LOL!
Nuya, let me tell you about these terms of due respect :
Bahurani( Bahu + Rani): DIL is the queen of the house . If she were treated as the queen of the house, Domestic Violence act would not have come into existence.
Grihalakhsmi or Ghar Ki Lakshmi : Griha(house) + Lakshmi(goddess of wealth) meaning she is the representative of family wealth. Do you know the price she has to pay for that title? She is held responsible for whatever wealth the family gets or looses, even though logically she is unconnected with it. If a man gets wealth due to her presence in the house he will praise her, but if he loses wealth out of his own mistakes and not any fault of hers, she will have to face the music. Haven’t you seen Deepa’s husband who blamed her for his foolishness and asked for divorce becoz his sister said that she brought bad luck? If we would have been largely governed by the correct usage of Bahurani, bride harassment would not have become an internationally known social issue.
“I feel that problem arise because both of them belong to different generations. That’s generation gap and could be easily solved by healthy compromises from both the sides.”
Haha ha Arvind,! thanks for realizing things so late. Bridging the generation gap is what I meant by EDUCATING the in-laws.
There are a lot more Mummy or Didi ka gulams than Joru ka Gulams. Man is peaceful when his wife moves over to her parents house. Mark these words Nuya !
Old is Gold ! Of course in the vedic period women were respected well and the customs were originally made with noble intentions. But see the way they have been distorted now. Dowry custom is an example of this. You know why? Because we are hanging between the old and new. We belong to nowhere. Ignorance and complete knowledge are bliss but we have half knowledge which is dangerous. We twisted our ancestral intentions to suit our necessities.
(Local Perspectives)
@lEENA,
Another frustrating article...full of wrong informations. I can’t understand why do you compare Deepa’s case with all wives of India?? Who said that in-laws have mentality of 19th century?
I have seen some cases where wives kicked her old in-laws out of their own house. Do the wives have 23rd century mentality?
If some wives think they are 21st century girls so they will not act as per their in-laws, who can stop the chaos and family break-up.
Everybody will fly like your ”free bird”
Another frustrating article...full of wrong informations. I can’t understand why do you compare Deepa’s case with all wives of India?? Who said that in-laws have mentality of 19th century?
I have seen some cases where wives kicked her old in-laws out of their own house. Do the wives have 23rd century mentality?
If some wives think they are 21st century girls so they will not act as per their in-laws, who can stop the chaos and family break-up.
Everybody will fly like your ”free bird”
(Local Perspectives)
@rUDRA,
If harassment of DILs was not happening to a lot of women in our country DV acts would not have come into existence.Harassment of women has been taking place for ages, I’m not the first one talking about it.
Go to an NGO, you’ll find people worse than Deepa. I’m speaking for those women.
If harassment of DILs was not happening to a lot of women in our country DV acts would not have come into existence.Harassment of women has been taking place for ages, I’m not the first one talking about it.
Go to an NGO, you’ll find people worse than Deepa. I’m speaking for those women.
(Local Perspectives)
Leena,
What a blunder writing is this!
Educate female children to withstand all social cruelties. You’re one of the fifth columnist.Girls must be wary about the social dangers and education alone will protect them. Don’t write for sake writing. Write pleasurable articles with unbiased notion. You bash female advancement of knowledge.Why so?
What a blunder writing is this!
Educate female children to withstand all social cruelties. You’re one of the fifth columnist.Girls must be wary about the social dangers and education alone will protect them. Don’t write for sake writing. Write pleasurable articles with unbiased notion. You bash female advancement of knowledge.Why so?
(Local Perspectives)
@Anne Mary !
For both your comments I would say, please read the article and the comments made by me and make an informed comment, if you can really understand what I want to convey. Irresponsible comments only expose your ignorance.
For both your comments I would say, please read the article and the comments made by me and make an informed comment, if you can really understand what I want to convey. Irresponsible comments only expose your ignorance.
(Local Perspectives)
Leena,
Why you have magnified individual rare cases beyond truth. Educated girls look after mother-in-laws well. They are good friends mutually. If mother in law dominates the home,things will go awry and askew. Think of nuclear family. Don’t give infringing sweeping remarks on mother-in-laws.
SAAS BHI KHABI BAHU THEE.
Why you have magnified individual rare cases beyond truth. Educated girls look after mother-in-laws well. They are good friends mutually. If mother in law dominates the home,things will go awry and askew. Think of nuclear family. Don’t give infringing sweeping remarks on mother-in-laws.
SAAS BHI KHABI BAHU THEE.
(Local Perspectives)
A rare individual case does not get laws enacted to resolve it, only wide spread and dire cases warrant the government’s attention. The problem was dire and wide spread enough for slow bureaucrats to notice, so why didn’t you notice?
(Global Perspectives)
Hi Everybody,
At this juncture, I can see that some people are saying that I am giving wrong information and magnifying rare individual cases beyond truth. So I thought of giving a pause to this discussion and talking a few points.
Firstly, can anybody tell me why stringent laws have been formed in recent times for the protection of women in our country? If DIL harassment would have been a rare issue, they would have been treated on a personal basis. Special laws for the protection of women would not have come into existence and enforced. Its been there for ages.
Now coming to the number of people suffering, when I went with Deepa to an NGO I found she was not a unique case. There were hundreds of women out there crying for their rights. Of course, the number was more with the illiterates, but the number of educated women suffering cannot be ignored. The problem is worse for educated women because being aware of their rights, they simply cannot take in any irrational behaviour from the in-laws just to respect some customs that were unfair to them. Reports vary from 50 to 70 percent of Indian women suffering DV at varying intensities. NGO reports, police records, media are full of such cases. Just read an example here:http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/1591
I am not denying the fact that there have been reforms and that many in-laws are good, but it is only because they have broken themselves free from the rigid mentality. That’s what I meant by educating in-laws. I know many of us out here are having good in-laws. It feels good to know that. You’ve got good in-laws and so have I. Let’s celebrate our bondages with our in-laws and shut our hearts out to those painful wails of all those women desperately seeking justice. Even if out of 10 people if 2 people are suffering for no fault of theirs, I will fight for those 2 people.
I don’t know why some people got the wrong impression that I was trying to say that an educated DIL can’t make a good DIL. Of course she can, but only when she is reciprocated by her in-laws. For the MIL and DIL to be intimate friends, a two sided effort should be there. Tell me, how many of you educated people out here can stay with in-laws who are not broad minded and accommodate your views? Unfortunately, there are quite a number of households in India that do not entertain the broadminded views of the DIL. Not you and I but a third person is suffering with these problems. So I plead lets not be insensitive to her pain. If you think I’m giving a wrong image, then this discussion is not worth continuing.
At this juncture, I can see that some people are saying that I am giving wrong information and magnifying rare individual cases beyond truth. So I thought of giving a pause to this discussion and talking a few points.
Firstly, can anybody tell me why stringent laws have been formed in recent times for the protection of women in our country? If DIL harassment would have been a rare issue, they would have been treated on a personal basis. Special laws for the protection of women would not have come into existence and enforced. Its been there for ages.
Now coming to the number of people suffering, when I went with Deepa to an NGO I found she was not a unique case. There were hundreds of women out there crying for their rights. Of course, the number was more with the illiterates, but the number of educated women suffering cannot be ignored. The problem is worse for educated women because being aware of their rights, they simply cannot take in any irrational behaviour from the in-laws just to respect some customs that were unfair to them. Reports vary from 50 to 70 percent of Indian women suffering DV at varying intensities. NGO reports, police records, media are full of such cases. Just read an example here:http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/1591
I am not denying the fact that there have been reforms and that many in-laws are good, but it is only because they have broken themselves free from the rigid mentality. That’s what I meant by educating in-laws. I know many of us out here are having good in-laws. It feels good to know that. You’ve got good in-laws and so have I. Let’s celebrate our bondages with our in-laws and shut our hearts out to those painful wails of all those women desperately seeking justice. Even if out of 10 people if 2 people are suffering for no fault of theirs, I will fight for those 2 people.
I don’t know why some people got the wrong impression that I was trying to say that an educated DIL can’t make a good DIL. Of course she can, but only when she is reciprocated by her in-laws. For the MIL and DIL to be intimate friends, a two sided effort should be there. Tell me, how many of you educated people out here can stay with in-laws who are not broad minded and accommodate your views? Unfortunately, there are quite a number of households in India that do not entertain the broadminded views of the DIL. Not you and I but a third person is suffering with these problems. So I plead lets not be insensitive to her pain. If you think I’m giving a wrong image, then this discussion is not worth continuing.
(Local Perspectives)
”Let’s celebrate our bondages with our in-laws and shut our hearts out to those painful wails of all those women desperately seeking justice. ”
Sorry for the wrong usage of the word bondage here. I meant to write bonding.
Sorry for the wrong usage of the word bondage here. I meant to write bonding.
(Local Perspectives)
Hi Everybody,
At this juncture, I can see that some people are saying that I am giving wrong information and magnifying rare individual cases beyond truth. So I thought of giving a pause to this discussion and talking a few points.
Firstly, can anybody tell me why stringent laws have been formed in recent times for the protection of women in our country? If DIL harassment would have been a rare issue, they would have been treated on a personal basis. Special laws for the protection of women would not have come into existence and enforced. Its been there for ages.
Now coming to the number of people suffering, when I went with Deepa to an NGO I found she was not a unique case. There were hundreds of women out there crying for their rights. Of course, the number was more with the illiterates, but the number of educated women suffering cannot be ignored. The problem is worse for educated women because being aware of their rights, they simply cannot take in any irrational behaviour from the in-laws just to respect some customs that were unfair to them. Reports vary from 50 to 70 percent of Indian women suffering DV at varying intensities. NGO reports, police records, media are full of such cases. Just read an example here:http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/1591
I am not denying the fact that there have been reforms and that many in-laws are good, but it is only because they have broken themselves free from the rigid mentality. That’s what I meant by educating in-laws. I know many of us out here are having good in-laws. It feels good to know that. You’ve got good in-laws and so have I. Let’s celebrate our bondages with our in-laws and shut our hearts out to those painful wails of all those women desperately seeking justice. Even if out of 10 people if 2 people are suffering for no fault of theirs, I will fight for those 2 people.
I don’t know why some people got the wrong impression that I was trying to say that an educated DIL can’t make a good DIL. Of course she can, but only when she is reciprocated by her in-laws. For the MIL and DIL to be intimate friends, a two sided effort should be there. Tell me, how many of you educated people out here can stay with in-laws who are not broad minded and accommodate your views? Unfortunately, there are quite a number of households in India that do not entertain the broadminded views of the DIL. Not you and I but a third person is suffering with these problems. So I plead lets not be insensitive to her pain. If you think I’m giving a wrong image, then this discussion is not worth continuing.
At this juncture, I can see that some people are saying that I am giving wrong information and magnifying rare individual cases beyond truth. So I thought of giving a pause to this discussion and talking a few points.
Firstly, can anybody tell me why stringent laws have been formed in recent times for the protection of women in our country? If DIL harassment would have been a rare issue, they would have been treated on a personal basis. Special laws for the protection of women would not have come into existence and enforced. Its been there for ages.
Now coming to the number of people suffering, when I went with Deepa to an NGO I found she was not a unique case. There were hundreds of women out there crying for their rights. Of course, the number was more with the illiterates, but the number of educated women suffering cannot be ignored. The problem is worse for educated women because being aware of their rights, they simply cannot take in any irrational behaviour from the in-laws just to respect some customs that were unfair to them. Reports vary from 50 to 70 percent of Indian women suffering DV at varying intensities. NGO reports, police records, media are full of such cases. Just read an example here:http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/1591
I am not denying the fact that there have been reforms and that many in-laws are good, but it is only because they have broken themselves free from the rigid mentality. That’s what I meant by educating in-laws. I know many of us out here are having good in-laws. It feels good to know that. You’ve got good in-laws and so have I. Let’s celebrate our bondages with our in-laws and shut our hearts out to those painful wails of all those women desperately seeking justice. Even if out of 10 people if 2 people are suffering for no fault of theirs, I will fight for those 2 people.
I don’t know why some people got the wrong impression that I was trying to say that an educated DIL can’t make a good DIL. Of course she can, but only when she is reciprocated by her in-laws. For the MIL and DIL to be intimate friends, a two sided effort should be there. Tell me, how many of you educated people out here can stay with in-laws who are not broad minded and accommodate your views? Unfortunately, there are quite a number of households in India that do not entertain the broadminded views of the DIL. Not you and I but a third person is suffering with these problems. So I plead lets not be insensitive to her pain. If you think I’m giving a wrong image, then this discussion is not worth continuing.
(Local Perspectives)
Leeeeenaaaaaa,
Just read your headlines:
”Don’t educate your daughter if you want an ideal bahu”
Wonderful:
I feel it should be
”Educate your daughter fully well if she wants to be an ideal bahu”
This is the dividing line,Leena.Okay.
Just read your headlines:
”Don’t educate your daughter if you want an ideal bahu”
Wonderful:
I feel it should be
”Educate your daughter fully well if she wants to be an ideal bahu”
This is the dividing line,Leena.Okay.
(Local Perspectives)
Anne Mary,
Well ! …..I can see that you’ve misunderstood the title ! Not your mistake. That’s why I asked you to read my comments. The title is meant to be a sarcastic one. Look this was how it happened:
When I went with my cousin Deepa, to a women’s organization, I found educated women coming there by the hour with their problems. What I saw was that in many cases the liberal mindsets of the girl were not entertained by the in-laws. Many of them were asked to abruptly cut short their careers and many others were insulted along with their parents just because in-laws thought they were superior. Now that was when I thought if in many households of our country education is not given its value and has failed to change the in-law mentality then of what use is it in our society ? Many an educated girl will think “why” because education gives you the power to think. If their whys are not answered with satisfactory answers, they will put their foot down. If you want a good marriage in these conservative households, then its better to not educate your girl. She will be happy with the role of a conservative bahu who will take in their orders without questioning their fairness.
If in-law conservativeness is ideal , and conservativeness and unconditional obedience is what we want from the DIL then, in that case, “DON’T EDUCATE YOUR DAUGTHER TO MAKE HER AN IDEAL BAHU”.
Of course a fully educated girl will make an ideal bahu. I’ve already given an example of that in my first comment addressed to everybody. But her affection should be reciprocated right?
The problem is with arranged marriages, where matches are finalized on the basis of superficial information. If you’re lucky it works, otherwise the girl had it. My point is why should any marriage break because of some rigid customs, when the girl is not at fault? Isn’t it better that we take steps to educate( change the outlook and value systems) of these rigid people and make it survive ? Narrow-mindedness has not done anybody any good anytime
Well ! …..I can see that you’ve misunderstood the title ! Not your mistake. That’s why I asked you to read my comments. The title is meant to be a sarcastic one. Look this was how it happened:
When I went with my cousin Deepa, to a women’s organization, I found educated women coming there by the hour with their problems. What I saw was that in many cases the liberal mindsets of the girl were not entertained by the in-laws. Many of them were asked to abruptly cut short their careers and many others were insulted along with their parents just because in-laws thought they were superior. Now that was when I thought if in many households of our country education is not given its value and has failed to change the in-law mentality then of what use is it in our society ? Many an educated girl will think “why” because education gives you the power to think. If their whys are not answered with satisfactory answers, they will put their foot down. If you want a good marriage in these conservative households, then its better to not educate your girl. She will be happy with the role of a conservative bahu who will take in their orders without questioning their fairness.
If in-law conservativeness is ideal , and conservativeness and unconditional obedience is what we want from the DIL then, in that case, “DON’T EDUCATE YOUR DAUGTHER TO MAKE HER AN IDEAL BAHU”.
Of course a fully educated girl will make an ideal bahu. I’ve already given an example of that in my first comment addressed to everybody. But her affection should be reciprocated right?
The problem is with arranged marriages, where matches are finalized on the basis of superficial information. If you’re lucky it works, otherwise the girl had it. My point is why should any marriage break because of some rigid customs, when the girl is not at fault? Isn’t it better that we take steps to educate( change the outlook and value systems) of these rigid people and make it survive ? Narrow-mindedness has not done anybody any good anytime
(Local Perspectives)
I wish every Indian parent who will morally go through the rigid systems of finding the ideal match for their daughter should ideally understand this article as reading alone won’t help. Earlier even I too had firm faith in arranged marriages but now I feel that even if you go by the tradtional systems, give atleast 6 months time to the girl to know the person literally. This kind of situation has already been faced by a friend of mine but fortunately she had time and was saved a month before her marriage.
I completely agree with you that either the windows shouldn’t be opened for her to see dreams or don’t educate her. The moment a girl steps out of her home for education she will definitely start thinking and you can’t really stop her. Most of the girls who manage to go for higher studies are given the ultimatum to be married as soon as she is through with her course giving her the feeling of being slaved. When a girl’s own parents refuse to understood her, how can she expect the same from an outsider. Even after 62 years of independence, society is still in the clutches of conserved thoughts.
I completely agree with you that either the windows shouldn’t be opened for her to see dreams or don’t educate her. The moment a girl steps out of her home for education she will definitely start thinking and you can’t really stop her. Most of the girls who manage to go for higher studies are given the ultimatum to be married as soon as she is through with her course giving her the feeling of being slaved. When a girl’s own parents refuse to understood her, how can she expect the same from an outsider. Even after 62 years of independence, society is still in the clutches of conserved thoughts.
(Local Perspectives)
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Dont expect the world to change for you unless you change yourself. How can a 20 omthing girl think about her 50/60 something inlaws to change to her way! radiculous..
Sure! But I would like to insert a word here that education never prevented any gal to meet the RATIONAL AND SENSIBLE expectations of husband or in-laws or parents. I suppose dowry demands, insulting a DIL, not fulfilling her basic necessities are all rational and sensible demands right?
Maybe you’ve come to the wrong post. This is about those hundreds of in-laws who make irrational and cruel demands of their daughters-in-law. They look upon them as servants and expect them to be money minting machines. Unfortunately this is happening quite frequently in our country and every other day in the newspapers, you hear about a daughter-in-law killed or committing suicide.
Many an educated girl want to look upon their MILs as mothers, but the point is how many MILS are reciprocating?
After hearing Deepa’s case, if you still feel that girls are talking I.me, myself, then I should say there is something terribly wrong with your judgmental skills. You are not human at all!
You are correct when you say that you have to change yourself for the world. And that’s why I said that get a mute lamb as a daughter-in-law, your problem will be solved. But education will always imbibe rational thinking in one who has it and thus she will want rational in-laws to match her liberal mindset.
If you don’t want to change a 50/60 in-laws to be more moderate towards their DILs they should not expect an educated girl.
Very well said Maya.
We need to have more women like you who have the ability to call spade a spade!
Hats off to your sense and sensibilities!LOL
A similar statement from me or any other male counterpart would have raised a storm !Thanks a lot from preventing the storm !
Look forward to more such views :-)
In too much hurry??
It seems you ate the sarcasm without peeling the skin off, LOL!
You know, in sarcastic language a ”spade” is not always ”a spade”
You cannot expect a change from in-laws but You expect a change from a gal who has just entered in to a new world and still in learning phase. Why everytime gals have to make changes in themselves for making her maried life successful?
You said that saying that — Marriage dont mean marrying a guy but his family becomes your own family. Its true that marriage is not just union of two people but union of two families but only gals have to accept this truth and they move farward with this fact in their life but how many guys accept gals family as his family. The whole family have to work out to make a marraige successful.